The Malaysian Anti-Corruption Commission (MACC) has stressed it would not hesitate to sink its talons into high-ranking individuals as it swoops down on illegal bauxite mining in Pahang.

However, the commission's director of investigations Azam Baki refused to divulge names.

Responding to a question on the involvement of big shots in the issue, Azam said, "I heard about that when we started our probe, but let me keep it close to my chest first.

"Rest assured. MACC has no issues with going after the big fish," he told the New Straits Times in an exclusive interview over the weekend.

MACC has arrested five Pahang Land and Mines Department (PTG) officers and three individuals who acted as runners so far.

"We will get to the bottom of it, irrespective of who they are," said Azam.

However, certain quarters have questioned if the anti-graft commission was only casting its net on the 'ikan bilis' (literally, anchovies, but to mean the 'small fish' in an illegal activity), with one former minister wondering about the role of the state executive councillors role in the imbroglio.

Commenting on this, Azam said: "We don't treat them as 'ikan bilis', considering the extent of the damage they had caused and the enormity of the damage. We don't care who they are, but those responsible for what happened in Kuantan will have to face the music."

No guidelines, slapdash system

The MACC director also noted how there was little or no proper guidelines being followed with regard to the Kuantan mining sector.

"Let's not even talk about illegal ones. The recent arrests we made showed that the lack of enforcement was among the main contributing factors to the problem. It is a major loophole in the system; the illegal miners knew that and seized the opportunity.

"In a way, the state government had allowed this to happen as it had been obvious to everyone that the system was so slapdash as to allow this kind of pollution to happen.

"The problem should have been nipped the minute it became obvious that something somewhere was clearly wrong," he said.

Asked if relevant agencies were concealing information from MACC, Azam replied that investigations revealed that the authorities did not cooperate or coordinate with each other for reasons best known to them.

"Only recently, the Terengganu menteri besar invited us to help them as the part of Terengganu bordering Kuantan was being affected by illegal mining in Kuantan.

"MACC was alone when we began our intelligence operations as only a handful of the people who were affected by the situation cooperated with us. When we discovered that the state's enforcement officers were involved, we had no choice but to use our informers and resources.

"With the problems in the direction of our investigation, we were forced to start from an area outside of our jurisdiction - environmental pollution. Only because it was obvious that abuse of power and corruption had allowed this to happen. I could not get anything from the state authorities," he added.

Azam also hoped the state government would reveal the necessary information to MACC in the interest of the public.

He said an audit should be conducted by comparing the export and the mining areas involved.

"As the Pahang menteri besar had admitted, the royalties should be more than what they collected. This shows how rampant illegal mining is in the area.

"It resulted in leakages in the revenue to Pahang as they (the illegal miners) do not pay royalties for the minerals they extracted.

"I must say, it looked like nobody even cared if royalties were collected. I think it is pertinent and only natural that, in doing business, due diligence is done, that forecasts are made as to how much royalties would be collected. In this case, the leakages cost the state government at least four times the earnings it registered," he added.

To another question, Azam said MACC had no issue with the state government allowing bauxite mining but it must put in place standard operating procedures.

"The bauxite issue has become a serious public issue, with the perception that corruption is rampant in the industry. The problem of poor enforcement affects not only the state authorities but some other enforcement agencies as well.

"The crux of the issue is simply that there are too many illegal miners, so much so that it went out of control.

"It was clear to everyone how the lorries were allowed to ply the routes, leaving a trail of damage and pollution. Even after one year of this going on, nobody seemed to care enough to do anything to arrest the problem," he added.